The Preferred Experience : The Podcast
Welcome to *The Preferred Experience*, a podcast dedicated to exploring the art of exceptional living and meaningful connections around small town life in and around the city of Prattville, Alabama. Join host Will Barrett and producer Stacy "Millzer" Mills where each episode features insightful conversations with thought leaders, innovators, and everyday heroes who share their unique journeys and the experiences that have shaped their lives.
Through engaging discussions, the podcast delves into topics such as personal growth, wellness, creativity, and the power of community. Listeners are encouraged to reflect on their own experiences while gaining practical tips and inspiration to enhance their everyday lives.
Whether you're seeking motivation, wanting to learn from others' successes and challenges, or simply looking to enrich your perspective, *The Preferred Experience* is your go-to source for cultivating a life full of purpose and fulfillment. Tune in and discover how to create your own preferred experience!
The Preferred Experience : The Podcast
Episode 25 - Behind the Headset: A Coach's Journey Through College Football and Beyond
From sideline strategies to administrative vision, Coach Caleb Ross takes listeners on a compelling journey through the evolving world of football in this candid conversation about his career path and the state of the game today.
After fulfilling his dream of coaching college football at Troy and Tulane, Ross found himself at a crossroads when doors began closing unexpectedly. His surprising transition to the Alabama High School Athletic Association reveals how sometimes our most meaningful opportunities emerge from unexpected places. "I truly feel like this is where God's leading me," Ross reflects, capturing the essence of his philosophy about trusting the journey rather than forcing a predetermined path.
The conversation provides a rare insider's glimpse into the reality of NIL (Name, Image, Likeness) in college sports. Ross doesn't mince words when describing the current landscape: "What is going on is not NIL... it's pay for play." He details the concerning practices of agent tampering, the constant need to re-recruit your own roster, and how these dynamics are fundamentally reshaping college football. His practical proposal for implementing contracts with buyout clauses offers a thoughtful solution to restore stability to a system increasingly dominated by transfer portal chaos.
Perhaps most poignantly, Ross shares his perspective on balancing professional ambition with family priorities. After years in the demanding college coaching environment where "it's a grind," his current role has allowed him to "catch my breath and have time to be a good dad again." This refreshing honesty about work-life tensions resonates beyond sports, touching on universal questions about career paths and personal fulfillment.
Whether you're a football enthusiast, a parent navigating youth sports, or someone interested in the intersection of faith and career choices, this episode delivers authentic insights that extend far beyond the gridiron. Subscribe now to catch future episodes of the Preferred Experience Podcast!
We are episode 25 of the Preferred Experience Podcast. It's been almost two years since we've been on with the Preferred Experience Podcast, to say the least. Some life events have been going on, but the Preferred Experience Podcast is back on, and I'm, of course, will Barrett. Everybody knows who I am, I'm just kidding, nobody knows me, but you do know our guest today, and he is none other than Coach Caleb Ross, a journeyman all over the country, and he's come back to the great state of Alabama. Coach, thanks for spending some time with us today.
Speaker 3:I appreciate you all guys having me on. It's pretty cool. I didn't realize it was 25. I did not know that.
Speaker 2:This is episode number 25. The last one we had was August of 23. That was the last one we had with Stacy Little at his laboratory, his food laboratory, and it was awesome. But, needless to say, things happened. The Preferred Experience podcast had to be derailed for a little while to take care of some life stuff. But here we are again and I can't think of a better way to kick it off, to restart the podcast, with having our buddy Caleb Ross with us today. And you got your daughter with you today.
Speaker 3:We do. Rebecca Clareire, I'm glad she's in. She wanted. She wanted to see how this all works. She was. She was very curious, so I told her. I said I'm not real sure how it's going to work, but I appreciate y'all having me on. I'm honored man it's pretty cool.
Speaker 2:Well, we, we like to keep it low key right here, unless unless you want to take it high key, of course but so we've been having a hard time getting getting our schedules together. You got young kids. You got jack playing baseball right now trying to get stuff together, and you are not even coaching him, are you?
Speaker 3:I'm not, uh, no, I one of the things I did for taking the job I wanted to coach. But then when the team he got picked up on, they already had a good little crew of coaches and stuff. So I said next year I'm gonna get out ahead and I did all these like I don't know, Pike road, uh leagues, whatever you got to do, all this uh pre background checks, all these things that did like three hours worth of work and I think I gave away a kidney to build a coach and didn't get to. So anyway, I'm certified now.
Speaker 2:So so is it tough to sit on the sideline while, while, while he's being coached. I mean, I know coaching's in your DNA.
Speaker 3:No, I'm a little. I have to be. When you coach. Y'all, all y'all know if you coach a kid, it is a lot of restraint. That's probably the best thing I could say. A lot of restraint Because you want them to enjoy it, you want them to be, you don't want their dad hovering over them. But there's times when you just can't help yourself. And I do pretty good. I'll go two or three games and let them coach him, and then there may be something where I just get loud and Amy will remind me hey, you got to go somewhere else, don't sit next to me doing all that. But I try to. I don't want to be that guy that's in the stands hollering and screaming at his kids. So I try to let it go Every with us kids. So I try to let it go Every. Now and then, though, the coaching part gets the best of me. It bubbles up to the surface.
Speaker 2:It does the coaching bubble very near the surface. Now you know I'm old enough. Mills are back there. I was old enough to remember, and you're old enough to remember, a time when kids played a season of baseball, a season of basketball and a season of football. But those days are vanishing rapidly with the rise of travel ball and all this stuff. It's 365. I mean, when's it going to be enough?
Speaker 3:You know, in our household I remember coming up a little background my roommate in college we used to joke around about all these because it was starting to happen. Like man, we're never going to be that, yada, yada. Well then I guess, going back man 12, 13 years ago, he invites me. He's from Mississippi, his little boy. They play in the trial ball tournament, mobile invited this over and it's like 40 bucks to get in.
Speaker 3:I'm like man who we seeing the Yankees, and so I'm talking to Blake and his son and man, they're playing in Mobile, they're going to like Destin, they're going to like Gatlinburg, and I'm like you become that person. And so I was like I'm not going to be that guy. We're going to to be seasonal, like you said. Sure enough, we get into it. Jack gets asked to play travel ball and there we are, we're behind the tents and we got the whole deal. And it just puts you in a bind because you want what's best for your kid but also you're afraid if he doesn't play and participate he falls behind and you want him. You know, like man, I want him to be good at it but not to consume him. We play travel ball in Troy. I will say, my son is very seasonal, he loves whatever sport he's in.
Speaker 3:So if it's baseball season, he loves baseball. If it's football season, he loves football, basketball. But just to stay competitive, because there's some really good little kids that are good balls players, he's the one he's got to go participate and do travel ball. So he got him asked to play on a travel ball team and we actually got practice this afternoon. So here we go.
Speaker 2:Going against everything.
Speaker 3:I said I wasn't going to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but it's what the kids want to do. Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 3:He enjoys it. He's starting to enjoy. Like I worried I think we kind of burned him drivable stuff, but he's starting. I can tell he's playing, enjoying it, he's having fun, he's having a good little year, so I can tell he's starting to bring back some of that passion for it and his buddies. He's starting to make good friends. They all play. So okay, here we go.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's right. Well, you have been around. You've been around the game of football for a very, very, very long time. We're getting a little older these days. I know, I know you got more white in your beard the last time I saw you, I do it's.
Speaker 3:Uh, my hair is turning white and it's turning loose, so I can't fight it.
Speaker 1:I hate it yeah, when I was playing around with my little aerial camera here and I was doing um, testing it out and everything I looked down, I was like what's that spot on top of my head? What? Oh, oh, boy, no, and you notice I got a hat on. Now it's, it's permanent hats. It's like what's that spot on the top of my head? What, oh, boy, no, and you notice I got a hat on now it's, it's permanent hats.
Speaker 3:It's sad, it's.
Speaker 1:I try, I fight it every day as you can see here, I'm having to wear a hat now because it's running away fast yeah, and we look like santa claus, this white beard soon.
Speaker 2:So but you I mean when, when, the first, the first time I met you, the first time I talked to you as the head coach at Prattville High School, I knew, like this guy's bigger than high school football, this guy's going to coach in college one day. And that was kind of your dream, right, it was To be a college football coach.
Speaker 3:And you did that and I mean I really had. You know, I guess we all have dreams, but I had two. I remember getting into coaching I wanted to one day be the head coach of Prattville High School. I really did. I always wanted to come back. It had to make sense, timing and all that. But I wanted that and I wanted to coach college. I got to do both of those things. It's like when you're at Prattville and we got settled, we were trying to build it and you know, trying to build a program, do all those things. And then I remember when I got offered that college job, man, that was a hard, hard decision Because you just think of like man. I got to finally fulfill one big dream. And you know, you take that job and you're like I don't know if the college thing is ever going to work out. But you know what, if we spend the rest of our life back in our hometown raising our kids being the head coach, man, that's a pretty good life.
Speaker 3:And then you know, man, chip Lindsey, called at the time. He was head coach of Troy, offering me the job and we did it and it was a great experience, man. I did four years of college football. I don't regret it. We got some cool experiences, man, and got to do a lot. I mean, I was labeled as an analyst but man, I was at smaller I guess not Troy's not small, but it's not SEC either so I got to coach. I got to do a lot of coaching. I got to be involved in a lot of game planning. I don't regret it.
Speaker 3:But it comes to a point where where is this going? You know what I mean and my kids are getting older. You just kind of set that rub in life of like, hey, yeah, I want to go fulfill these dreams, but what I can't live with myself if I'm not a good dad, if I'm not a good father, not a good husband. In that lifestyle college is totally different. Man, I grind, it is a grind, I can't. I got buddies at Coach High School and being a head high school coach was a grind. I I mean, when you're the head coach at Prattville High School, it's not a 40-hour work week, it's just not Even in the offseason it's about four full-time jobs, as I remember.
Speaker 2:Man, you gotta be the administrator, you gotta be the janitor you gotta be the head coach.
Speaker 3:Well, that've got a better setup now with Blake Boren there. I mean he's doing a lot of the stuff I was trying to get done as the head football coach. I mean some of the sponsorship stuff, but anyway. But even high school football is not the grind college is. I used to think that it would be comparable. You get in that college world, man, and just the recruiting aspect never stops. You get home. When you get home, which could be man in season? You're not going to get home that close to 11, 12 o'clock at night. But even this time of year when you think you get home at 637, you've got kids to call, kids to text. They're texting you back. And then Saturdays when you think, oh, I'm going to go spend time with my family, no, you've got a junior day and you've got to recruit and visit, and they're all day long events, you know I mean just, but you know what it was.
Speaker 3:Um, I worked for good people. It was a great experience, uh and it you know, man, we actually enjoyed living down in mandeville in the new orleans area. Man, that was a cool experience.
Speaker 2:But uh, but anyway, and as you were coming, as you were coming into college football, something else was coming into college football as well, a little thing called n Right and it's completely changed the landscape of college athletics. It has. And at Troy there wasn't much of an NIL program, but at Tulane, when you left Troy and went to Tulane, then you had a collective to work with there. Talk about that and how you have to manage that and the egos involved and all that You're right.
Speaker 3:At Troy we didn't have much of one. We had a little bit of money. They were creating one and building it. Coach Summerall was doing a really good job of trying to get out in front of that and trying to build it. But Troy in a lot of ways reminds you a little bit like Prattville. I'll say this it's a proud place, proud tradition. They'll come watch it on Saturdays. I mean mean you'd be blown away. I go watch a Troy, a really good Troy home football game. You were 15, 20 thousand people. It could be on some we've had 25. So they support it. But financially I they support in facilities.
Speaker 3:But they're just saying a ton of like just big, you know, booster donors and all that there. So you're having to really squeeze the lemon dry to get money. But not a lot of tim cooks coming out of. No, there ain't, there's not, yeah, there's not these multi-million dollar boosters that are, you know, pumping four million dollars into ni, it's just not, not there. So what little money you raise there? You're doing it to retain the. You know some of the players you have, but but that becomes the rub. You may say, hey, I can give you. You know, I mean I can give you 40 grand and that may be over whatever, or 4 000 a month, and you know 12, 12 installments or however that works.
Speaker 3:But then when, if west virginia comes along, texas a&m comes along, says the choice paying you 40, we'll pay you 275 and give you a vehicle. I mean you're like you can't compete with that. So you're right, go to two lane. And I and I know in this part of the world of people not familiar who Troy, I know, they know Troy, but John Sumrall, people that were big Troy guys couldn't understand why would Coach Sumrall leave Troy to go to Tulane. Isn't that a lateral move? And I said, well, I guess if you grow up as just a novel college football fan you would think that.
Speaker 3:But if you know anything about college football, deep two lanes, just a bigger job. I mean it's got more, it's in a bigger conference and the money they have, I mean we had a collective that could anywhere from two to three million dollars. So, like you're saying, if you're talking about troy, that who may have a hundred thousand dollars, if that maybe 200 now at this point to spend on a roster, you go to two Tulane where you've got two to three million. You're going to get better players. Sure, and it shows it does, and we have better players Top 25 program.
Speaker 3:Here's the one thing I always get asked about the NIL, though, because they're like how do you deal with those kids? How do you coach them with the egos? I never we never dealt with that at Tulane, like once the kids got there, because we didn't and it's a we didn't. I never made any negotiation with any kid, I just even our position coaches and coordinators really didn't do that. Coach Summerall probably did. But now they got these things in college football. Y'all have seen them. They've hired general managers.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And it's really run more like a professional organization and that person and usually I know at Tulane. But when I left we had two guys. We had a guy that managed our roster and he kind of helped with. He helped with recruiting and where we need to go and this and that and like all that. But then we had a guy that was a money guy, that he knew the details, ins and outs of how to work, contracts and stuff. And it's crazy to think, looking back, like what college football has become and cause, like the word that people or the or the phrase or the saying that people will say is I don't even recognize it.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And I and I get it. But I will say, once you finally got to the kids, they were great. I actually enjoyed kids yeah, they, because I would say this always like when you're dealing with that level of athlete, you've got to think these are the guys that probably are some of your better athletes in high school physically, but also mentally. They're better, they want to win, they're there. They all have a dream. Yeah, they want to make a little money there, but a lot of these guys want to go play in the NFL. So it's like once they stepped inside not always you dealt with a few issues, but once they stepped inside the meeting room or stepped on the practice field or stepped in the facility, they were pretty business and they were all balls. So I actually enjoyed that part. We didn't, like I said, we didn't deal with much, but you would hear of guys like hey, johnny called our collective and he said he needs more cash, he needs more money, and you're like well, johnny needs to catch more balls on.
Speaker 3:Saturday if he wants more you know stuff like that Performance-based NIL, and you get some of that. Where it really gets ugly. The part that's and it's starting to get out there now more is the tampering and the agents. And when I mean what is nasty and I don't college, ncaa has no grip on this right now is you've got these rogue agents who are representing these kids and it starts about it probably starts now, but I remember about mid-season last year they're starting to shake down these kids and they're starting to shake down other rosters and they're representing these other schools. So, like we didn't, our quarterback had an agent or whatever, and he's already shopping him around by week five, week six to see what the bidder is on it, and he's leveraging Tulane at the same time doing this. So if you can imagine that's going on at Tulane at a smaller level, what's going on in the SEC? Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:Yeah, hugh Freeze came to the A-plus banquet here, I think about last year, maybe a year or two ago, and you could just see the energy level that he normally brings. It wasn't quite there because they're asking questions about NIL and he just kind of sinks in his chair Because you can tell it just drags on these guys because that's not what they signed up for when they started coaching college football years and years ago. It's completely a different animal now you mentioned in the SEC. The NIL collectives are just massive. These kids are millionaires by the time they're 18 years old. Here's what I struggle with.
Speaker 3:There's a lot of money being made in college football. You see the TV rights, these athletes, they're making it off their ability. They should be getting paid. They should I 100% agree with this Agree Off of the true NIL. But what is going on is not NIL, no, it's college is paying players Pay for play and you don't blame the kids because somebody's going to give me a million dollars. Who's going to give me a million dollars? Who's going to say no if my son and say, hey, school wants to pay him a million? No, we're not going to do that. That's nobody's going to do that.
Speaker 3:So I don't blame the kid, but it's not name, image and likeness, it's not, it's not his ability, it's on the. It's just basically a pay-for-play. And that's the part. That's just where it's hard to gosh. You don't even. It's just kind of gotten out of hand and I don't know what they're going to do.
Speaker 3:The other part that when a coach comes out and there's some really good things that are being said, man, you got these social media bandits and they'll get on there and they're like well, it's easy for him to say this coach makes five million a year or whatever. Okay, maybe that's fair, but his message is right, like. But it's almost like people start attacking the coach and then the message gets lost and that's why I don't understand, like, why people will go after. But I don't think anybody agrees how this is sustainable. But anyway, that's the part of NIL.
Speaker 3:So when the seasons are with, it's like we had a three-week run there. When seasons are with, where you're dealing with your own roster, all of them are looking to better their situation, yeah, and so they're all either getting shopped around by agents or they're wanting us to. Some of them truly want to stay at Tulane. They made a home there, they like it there, but their agents is sitting there putting it in their ear hey, tulane may only give you 30, 40 grand a year. You can go make 100 here or whatever, and it's just like trying to it was every day. You never knew who was going to walk in saying, hey, he's going to get in the portal.
Speaker 2:It's got to be a mind scramble for these kids because they're thinking I mean $100,000 for some of these kids is like generational money. That's right. A million is if I get this for a couple years I don't have to go to the NFL yeah, but they're one injury away from losing all that, yeah. So that's got to be just a mind game.
Speaker 3:You're constantly having to re-recruit your own roster Constantly and it's just the way. It's not that you, because how do you coach them? Well, really true, the best athletes mentally, who are strong, they want to be coached. That's one thing. They don't want you to be, but you have to approach it.
Speaker 3:The old Bear Bryant, the old do-as-I-say, the military sergeant, those days are gone. It's gone in any sport, but it's really gone Like you can't, but always like when I would coach and I coach guys, but I was like, hey, I'm another set of eyes for you. I mean, you can listen to me, I can help you understand this offense, understand what you're supposed to do, and if you do that, buy in, I'm going to help you benefit your career. Obviously we're going to win as a team, but your career you're going to be just going to help market yourself. You're going to be a better player and most of those guys truly understood that. So they let you coach them. But now the days are just berating them in old school. Don't forget. If you do that now, they're they're gone pretty quick, I ain't got to deal with this, yeah and they don't, there's somebody out there they'll be glad to take them and what.
Speaker 3:What stinks for high school. This is where I'm going to tie it back into high school sports. So the portal, because now if you've had 12 upperclassmen, or I'll say another 21 juniors and seniors say they're going to go in the portal, well, you can't go, replace them with 21 high school kids because, they're not ready.
Speaker 3:So what you're going to do is your roster of 85 or 105, now, whatever it is. You look up, if there's 60 kids that are freshmen or sophomores, you're probably not going to win many games, Probably not. And then that administration is going to come to you and say, hey, you got to go. And we're going to come to you and say, hey, you got to go, and we're going to bring in somebody else. So it forces the college coach. Then I can't sign a high school kid. I got to go sign another college kid. I got to get a three, a guy with three years of experience and as a college recruit. And these guys you know, these guys got warts, Like I will say this, a lot of these guys. They're not great players, but they at least have experience. You know what I mean? It's like this kid's got a lot of flaws but he's better than that raw kid coming out of high school that's got a bunch of potential, because he's ready now and the university hasn't given me three years to develop that kid.
Speaker 2:That's what it's like, and if that raw freshman comes in and sits on the bench for a year, he'll probably leave. He's mad.
Speaker 3:Or if he comes in and is unbelievable and you're at a place like Tulane, he ain't going to be there anyway, right? So it's like, let's just take the guy, the true veteran, who's like, hey, man, this may be my last chance. I'm going to take him, I'm dealing. He understood what college football is about. He may be a little more grateful, it may not leave me if he has a pretty good year.
Speaker 3:I mean, it's just a catch, these college coaches I know this just talking to the guys I work with and the guys I know they talk to other guys they had worked with what is said in public is not what's being said behind closed doors, because I think all these guys will come out in the public and say, well, it's just, you know, man, you've got to adapt or die. Man, college football, and some of them will gripe and stuff, but, like you know, and some of them will gripe and stuff, but most of them. I ain't saying they're miserable, yeah, but you're right, it's not what they signed up for 20-something years ago. But anyway.
Speaker 2:So how do you put? I mean, obviously something's got to be done to put this genie back in the bottle to some degree.
Speaker 3:Can it be done? I don't know. I think they've got to at some point go to contracts. I think they got to at some point go to contracts. I think the universities are afraid to do that because you make them employees and what happens to like insurance and time to leave and all the things the tax issues with that.
Speaker 4:Just the 1099.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean all that stuff. I think universities don't want to take on those beasts. And then you've got title. I mean there's so much, you know, employee benefits. I think that's why they're really trying not to do that. But I think that's the only way I ain't saying save, because I think college football ain't going anywhere, but the only way to make it where it makes sense. Because here's the way I look at it If I'm the starting tight end at Auburn and Georgia approaches me and says, hey, auburn's paying you half a million a year to start and tie it in, we'll pay you a million, I hate Georgia.
Speaker 3:Georgia pays them a million. Well, you know what it is. It's a free country. How can anybody tell me I can't go? That's cool, I'm going to go to Georgia. But Georgia then needs to go write a check to Auburn to buy him out of that contract. Right, that buy him out of that contract, his buyout, right? That's a good point. And so now what's going to happen is, if they know they've got to write a check, they're less likely to go tamper, they're less likely to go in if there's a cap and hey, I'm not going to. If I know I've got to give something over to my rival to take that kid, which to me is only fair. Buy him out of his contract.
Speaker 3:Now Auburn, who spent three years developing this kid, made him all this time, poured him, made him to a great athlete. Don't just left holding nothing. They at least hey, you know what? We at least got the money for his contract. Or I'm going to sign this really good player out of high school. Hey, if you'll come to Auburn, I'm going to put you on a three-year deal. The first year you may make $250,000. The second year we'll pay you five. Your third year, if you're here in three years, we'll pay you a million dollars. So now there's incentive for these guys to see it through. To see it through, yeah, that's right. And if you want to go somewhere else, they've got to buy you out of your contract. They've got to pay you the full.
Speaker 3:What's going to happen now is you'll actually see kids stay at programs. There'll be movement because somebody will buy a guy out of a contract, but you'll see guys stay in their program. In my opinion, they'll stay there. They'll see it through, knowing there's incentive to stay. They're going to get paid more and I think it'll slow down this madness a little bit and then what will happen is less kids will transfer and then it'll go back to colleges recruiting high school kids and develop them again, because now there'll be more spots and it'd be more incentive to sign those type contracts. There's a lot of flaws in that. That's not an easy fix, but this is just my opinion. I think they're going to have to get to the contract part and then even like a place like a troy or a south alabama, let's say, yay, sign a kid and he becomes a great player. There's got to be some type of fee that these big schools, because they're just it's decimating a group of fives.
Speaker 3:FCS football is a JUCO league. I mean literally half their roster turns over every year. So it's like why would anybody want to coach in that? I mean you can't build a program unless you just got used cars and sales and you can just hustle kids in there. But you know, I don't know how do you can't build a program. So if these like if I keep using Georgia, but if Georgia wants and you can just hustle kids in there, but you know, I don't know how do you can't build a program. So if these like if I keep using Georgia, but if Georgia wants to go, take Troy's best player, they probably can't buy him out of a contract because he didn't have a great contract to begin with. But there's got to be some type of fee. You've got to pay Troy University $200,000.
Speaker 2:And there should be full disclosure. If you go to georgia, your old men and women will bark at you all the time, and that's just ridiculous.
Speaker 3:I hate georgia, I really don't like, but anyway, that's a long. That's a long answer to a short question, but anyway, that's my nil soapbox and then you know the.
Speaker 2:The trickle down effect of that is real too. Like georgia, high school athletic association now allows nil. Yeah, how long before the hsa does something like that or has to give into it?
Speaker 3:You know, I've been asked that a couple times. I don't know. I know this. Georgia has modified theirs, they have modified theirs and they felt pressure early on to do it. I'll say this there's a growing two parts.
Speaker 3:I do think at some point there will be a version of this in high school sports. I don't know when. I don't know when. I don't think it's going to happen as soon as people think in Alabama there's a lot of people just aren't in favor of it. I'm not, Not for high school kids. I think there's a lot of.
Speaker 3:There is a thought now. It's like, hey, before we pass this into effect, let's pump the brakes. Let's see how this is going to land in college football, because it's changed every year. So for us to just rush out and pass a bill and allow NIL college football, the version of NIL now is probably not what it's going to be five years from now. So why not? Let's wait and see how that looks.
Speaker 3:Again, if a kid is truly making money off his ability, how can you say no to that? But everybody in this room, how many people do we know? How many high school kids can you think of all time? I mean, I can only probably think of a handful could truly get money off of his ability Maybe LeBron James when he came out, maybe some superior track athlete. But what it is all NIL is is still pay for play. I mean like, and those contracts are real. I've seen a few but then you start looking at those contracts and the companies that are behind them they're also the companies, the nil groups that are, that run certain universities nil programs. You're like man, it's just dirty it's just very like it's very slimy, yes and like.
Speaker 3:And the question asked like who's going to so what? Because I, just my heart of hearts, I don't think Joe's tire shop is going to put a high school kid on the front of his building to promote. Nobody's going to care enough. You know what?
Speaker 3:I mean Sitting varsity blues right, I mean, there may be a handful of incidents around. You know, like I said, there may be a phenom like a LeBron James when he was coming out, or you know somebody like that. Yeah, I could see that where people. But really what it is is, these kids are getting contracts because on the future that they're going to sign a bigger contract Right, that's really what it is. Hey, well, this NIL groups will pay this kid 40,000 to go play high school sports because he wants 20% of his $2 million contract when he chooses between Florida and Georgia. So these guys are playing the long game. Yeah, and that's what. That is the reality of what's going on. So, yeah, if that's what people want, then I guess that's what a state legislator passes. That's what they want. I don't know. I just that's not. I don't think anybody agrees. That's what's really meant to be high school athletics?
Speaker 2:no, but certainly, certainly. I would think that the funds, the funds exist for there to be nil in the state of alabama. When you look around at the arms race of facilities that exist for athletics in the state, I mean it's, it's crazy. You remember, yeah, you were around when pratwell built the indoor, first of its kind and the first turf field and it launched this arms race in the state. We kind of took a back seat in that. But these other schools came up and just built palaces. And now you at the HSAA, you see all this stuff. You get to tour around and see it all firsthand. What's the deal? I mean, how do you compete with that? You really can't compete with that here right now.
Speaker 3:No, and we, everybody in this room knows, and it's been well documented, just you know, man, the funding for education and athletics, and I do think Prattville's making a lot of progress, sure, compared to where we were five years ago, I think that's. Everybody can see that.
Speaker 2:But you're still. They're doing everything they can with what they have. That's it.
Speaker 3:And what people understand. It is very nice. I know the people are priesthood, that are supporters of athletics or at least are priesthood. But what is trying to be done? I mean, I think, just from the outside.
Speaker 3:I've had the beauty of being in it for a few years, stepping out and kind of looking on the outside in. You're glad to see some stuff, but, like I tell people, you're still 10, 15 years behind, even what you're doing now. I hadn't even really caught up to what some of these others and I think we said it a couple years ago and just if we're moving to the high school talk, I always said I was like man if people would go see that region around Birmingham. We saw it this past year and then Prattville got put in that region, yeah, and I think it really opened a lot of eyes to people who went up there and they traveled and they took their son to go watch that game and they're like, wow, it's like guys, we've been comparing yourselves to Montgomery and Elmore County and you're nowhere in the ballpark to what these schools are doing and what they're funding, how they're funding their high school education and athletics.
Speaker 2:Well, heck, caleb, the danger of it now is that we go to these games and we see these big places and the kids decide, well, this is what I'm going to play next year. And so they do it. I'm like, oh great, now they're further behind the eight ball. Yeah, getting exposed to things you didn't know existed, I agree.
Speaker 3:And that existed, I agree. That's the day we always talked about going back to the college talk. When I was at Tulane last year, we played Oklahoma and we played Kansas State. You're almost like man you want to go beat these schools but you're hoping none of these guys have too good of a game because, then, Oklahoma's going to start saying hey, man, that's a great game. You look good in a crimson and white uniform.
Speaker 2:Nobody looks good in a crimson and white uniform. Nobody looks good in a crimson and white uniform. Oh yeah, well, sorry, I'm sorry, I'm not a poor choice of words. No, no, that's okay, I'm going to. I can't even focus now that you said that.
Speaker 3:That's okay. Crimson and cream, how about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, oh, crimson, okay, I don't even like that. It's too close, oh man. But you are now. You stepped out of the coaching realm and stepped into an administrative role as assistant director of the HSA. Talk about how that transition happened.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I had a mentor, a friend of mine, just back going I guess early part of December. That just checks in with me probably periodically and he's a pretty important figure in the state, but anyway, reached out to me and just we got talking about stuff and he said, hey, I wanted to see how you're doing. I said, well, I'm doing good. And I knew like after this year at Tulane I kind of gave myself a three-year window of, hey, man, if I'm not climbing the ladder in college football, then I don't know if we'll stay, because it is. I mean, you go from being a head coach to now you're going to go back to low man on totem pole. And I knew that and I lowered myself and it was good not to, probably for a few, a little bit, not be in charge of everything, but then after a while you know you're like, all right, we need, are we moving up the world? Because, just to say, we're wearing a college logo. That was cool for a couple years, but eventually, man, you want to advance your career. Anyway, so when we went down to Tulane and a little bit of backstory for me I was at Troy. I was an analyst in 2023.
Speaker 3:At the end of after the conference championship game, john Sumrall, head football coach, comes to me and says hey, I'm about to make you the tight ends coach. I'm going to make some changes on our staff. I'm going to move our tight ends coach to be the O-line coach. I'm going to move you into his spot, heck of a coach. And this is kind of what we are. This is the goal. This is it. We finally got a chance to be on the field, be one of the 10. I was going to be a contract guy. I'm already out on the road recruiting. I'm up in Tennessee. I was in Mississippi. I'm coming back down doing the Super 7. And I'm pretty close with Coach Summerall and our families are.
Speaker 3:But there was buzz about Wednesday or Thursday that hey, coach may be leaving and we're on the road recruiting. You're in these schools and you're like, like getting these texts, like what's going on. But then you got to go in. Hey, I'm troy. You know it's. That's a weird dynamic that you appreciate, these guys that go through because you're sitting there recruiting for troy knowing, like man, I might not even know where I'm going to be next week. You know what I mean. So, and that happens a lot, uh. But so finally we, I remember leaving the super seven thursday night and I get a text hey, he's taking the two lane job. You're like, man, what's going on? So anyway. So the next day, sure enough, he calls everybody off the road and says hey, we're going to have a staff meeting at two o'clock, and by then you already kind of know, and, and I, I knew, but yeah, anyway. So, and I knew, and some of our guys on our staff didn't, they're calling me. What's going on?
Speaker 3:I'm like man, guys, y'all all smart enough something. This ain't good anyway. Anyway, call back in. He's going to Tulane, all right. Then what's going to happen for us? Well, there's this whole deal. Hey, I think when Troy hires somebody, it could be the OC, the DC, and they're like hey, you'll stay as tight ends, coach. Anyway, long story short, I'm going to make this quick.
Speaker 3:It came down between our OC, dc and then a guy named Jared Parker, who you know OCDC, and then a guy named Jared Parker who I had no clue was. Jared Parker gets the job, all right, notre Dame, oc, whatever, john, whatever, jared Parker, you know whatever. But you know, look, I like Coach Parker. I think he's a good dude. But anyway, coach Summerall knew him. So he's like hey, I think. He said here's the deal. So I finally sat down with you and he said well, I think you're going to have an opportunity at both. He said I don't know what Tulane looks like, there's a couple guys on staff I'm going to have to keep. I potentially would have an on-the-field spot, potentially could be off the field. But he said I think Coach Parker is going to keep you. I've talked to him. He said I think you've got to make that decision. If you want to come, we'll work it out, but if not, I think at the time it probably makes sense to stay In the state of Alabama. My connections are here high school sports, yada, yada. Well, I finally sit down, talk with Jerry Parker and he's like look, I feel good about doing this, but I don't have OC yet and I don't want to cram every hire down his throat saying you got to hire this guy, so be patient. I feel like that we're going to do this.
Speaker 3:Well, all right, that's like on a december 27th well, I remember christmas eve, excuse me, new year's eve night I'm leaving my family's house. We had like a little get together and jerry park calls, says hey, I got to bring my own guy from notre dame as italian's coach. Um, so you're like oh my goodness. And there were some good high school jobs that were open. Just full disclosure. Hoover was open and I'd gotten a few phone calls. Would you be interested? I mean, they didn't offer me the job, but would you be interested? Maybe, but I really want to stay college. Well, those had already passed. I mean, they were about to hire somebody. So you're like man, what are my options?
Speaker 3:Called Coach Summerall told him what happened. He said, well, let me work on it. Next day he says, hey, I got a spot. It's not going to be exactly what you want, it's an analyst spot. So moved our whole family down to New Orleans. It was a great experience. But you just kind of understood like your connections around Alabama just didn't feel like you were. Things were progressing the way they wanted were progressing the way they wanted, even though I got to coach and do a lot. So anyway, I know that's a long back story but of why we're here. So we're already kind of a little frustrated. Just what? Just you know me just like man where we're going.
Speaker 3:I get a phone call from a mentor and says hey, I got two things I want to present to you one there's a good high school job.
Speaker 3:If you want it, I think they'll hire you, uh, and and I'll you know whatever relevant to the job. But anyway, I said, okay, I'll think about that. And he said but I got another thing. He said would you be interested in being over football for the Alabama High School Athletic Association? Caught me way off guard. No, they had. No, I mean truly out of left field, yeah, like man, I ain't really ever thought about that. And he said I think you would do a great job and I think it could be something that if you did a really good job, I could honestly see in the future you being the guy he said. And I've always thought that. And he said well, you know, obviously you've got to do a good job in what you're doing. But I said well, let me think about it. We go play in a bowl game.
Speaker 3:Another school, another college in the state, hired a new coach at the group of five level. I knew him through him recruiting Prattville High School. Y'all can probably figure put two and two together, man. So I thought I had a chance to get on there. At one point I thought I was going to be the running backs coach there and even Coach Summerall talked with him, said I think he's going to hire you. Well, that fell through, wow. And I talked with Coach Summerall and he's like man, look, you've done a heck of a job, but you don't have connections in Louisiana. So if I do have an opening, am I going to have to hire somebody in Louisiana? So you're sitting there thinking I don't know if I've got a future at Tulane. I'm hitting him. I can stay here in the same role, but I'm not going to grow.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it makes sense to go back and get on a school in Alabama, but I just tried and they ended up hiring somebody else. So it's like man, what are my options here? And it's almost like anytime a college door kept opening up. I tried to go in it. It was shutting. But every time I was talking to Heath Harmon with the association, he's like hey, I really want you. I said well, man, can you give me time? You're the guy I want. I'll be patient. What about this? Can you help me with this? Can we get to this? It was yes, yes, yes, yes. So you felt like every door kept opening, yeah, so we prayed.
Speaker 3:And man, we made the decision, we're going to do it and so, yeah, we took the job. It's a different role, but I've really enjoyed what it's allowed me to do. On most days it's an eight to five, but you do have to cover events. Those are long days, things like that. But for the most part, it's allowed me to catch my breath and have time to be a good dad again and have time to be a family man. Anyway, that's a long. I know that's probably way too long of an answer.
Speaker 2:No, that's great.
Speaker 3:It's a short question, but that's kind of how it all came. It was really well. I guess what I'm saying I truly feel like this is where God's leading me. Yeah, and I mean that I truly like this is where God wants me in this role. I'm embracing it. We want to make the most of it. We want to make a career out of it. I will tell people man, we have all learned to, because I get asked all the time will you go back into coaching?
Speaker 3:I was like man, I don't know. I know this. I'm enjoying what I do, I want to make the most of this, but I've learned to never say never. I mean and not saying I'm trying to leave a door open. I'm not. We're going full speed ahead. We're doing the best of this job and see where this takes us. But you also learn that I mean just like you know God, I know this. Where I'm supposed to be right now is where I'm at.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, it's the old adage when God closes a door, he opens a window. It sounds like that was not your case. It sounds more your case. It sounds like more like when god closes this door, he opened the garage door. For this is the way. Yeah right, probably not. Not anything you had planned, no, but god had it ordained from the start.
Speaker 1:And um dick hey I just wanted to you. You were talking about how fast everything moved. I got a. I got a little story you may not even remember this about concerning you when it how fast things move. It was a few years back. It was after your first year down there at Troy. Yeah, my sister was going to stay with my cousins down on the coast. So I was like, okay, I'll go meet them halfway in Troy, we're going to pick them up and everything.
Speaker 1:So I called Caleb the day before hey, I'm going to be inroy saturday it was like a saturday hey, can I come by and just check out the place and holler at you? And he goes oh yeah, yeah, just just happy, go lucky, having just good old time as he. But yeah, come on by anytime. So we go troy. I'm in troy eating at the um. What's the place? The home cooking place, the big giant one that everybody goes to. Oh yeah, sisters, sisters, we're sitting there eating and you know I'm getting ready to go. You know, as soon as they get due they're going to take off and I'm going over to campus and everything. And then I see my phone ringing and it's Caleb and I pick up the phone and say, hey, what's up? And he goes. And the voice went from pure, you know happy-go-lucky the day before to Stacy. I'm not going to be able to meet with you today.
Speaker 1:We've got some things going on around here and things are getting a little tense. I can't get into it right now, but I'm going to have to. Just, we're not going to be able to do it today. I was like, oh, and then, you know, you know how the coaching world operates and I'm clicking my head. You know I almost want to say hey, coach, don't worry about it. I know exactly what you're saying. And literally by the time I left Sisters and got back to Booth, alabama, chip Lindsey was let go.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it happens in the blink of an eye it is and you're just in disarray. I mean, those are wild. That experience is different when you truly have. I've been very blessed. I've never been fired, but I have been in a very not knowing what the future state twice now, once when Coach Lindsey was let go, and that was wild too, man. I just don't know who they're going to hire, and that was what was frustrating. There is that? Finally, you know I was coaching. That's a wild story.
Speaker 3:I was an analyst and you know the NCAA didn't really allow analysts to coach. But this ain't shocking news. But the group of five level every analyst coach and you just had to, like you know, hide around compliance and all that. Uh. So the first day of august, our tight ends coach, special teams guy, uh, dane brown, who's now the new head coach at faultner yeah, whatever test positive for covid was when covid still going on. So coach lindsey comes to him. He says, hey, you got to go in in that room. Tight ends, coach, tight ends. So he's doing his 14 days or whatever all the crazy regulations, whatever.
Speaker 3:Ends coach tight ends. So he's doing his 14 days or whatever all the crazy regulations, whatever. So I coach tight ends the whole August camp. He comes back and he gets back in that room. He's like man, you keep it up, right now I'm just going to help. Well, he's there a day or two and he goes to Coach Lindsey and says, hey, caleb is doing it, he can handle it, he's a good enough coach, he can handle the room. It would allow me to focus more on special teams. So I coached tight ends the whole year. His name was on it, he got the contract for it and all that. And that's other parts about analyst spots and I'll get to that here in a second. So I got to coach and then Coach Lindsey gets let go, brandon Hall becomes the interim. He puts me on the field.
Speaker 3:So I was an on-the-field tight ends coach for the last game of the year for Georgia State and I got to go recruit. I was actually with Super 7. I was helping the guys that we had committed. That was my job and I was so excited to be in college football. You get these vets. When they got they were like man bump. This I'm not, I'm recruiting, happy to be there. So I'm like, hey, man, somebody's got we got six kids committed, somebody's got to make sure they're going to be committed to Troy. So I'm driving all over the state, you know, recruiting Anyway.
Speaker 3:And then Coach Summerall gets hired and what was good for me is Coach Summerall had recruited McGill to him. He recruited Mobile. So I knew him, had a good relationship with him, and he's like look, I don't want you to go anywhere, I want you to stay. And so I ended up staying. One thing about that analyst stuff it's a little bit off topic, but it's kind of the thing about those jobs. We go to Tulane and we brought our offensive staff with us. So I know our offense and I got put in and Coach wanted me to go in the room with the wide receivers. Our wide receiver coach got named Carter Sheridan Really good dude, really good recruiter, a really good position coach.
Speaker 3:He knows how to coach the position. Wide receiver had nothing about our offense, so I know our offense. So what happened? And look, he's a smart guy, he was learning it, but I knew it. I knew the ins and outs. So by come fall camp man, I'm running a lot of our meetings. I'm doing a lot of the installs, you're doing a lot of the corrections, you're doing a lot of the in-game adjustments. You're doing a lot of the tips and reminders. You're coaching the position. The hard part of that is he's got the contract. He's got the two-year contract. You're an at-will employee. He's got the bowl bonus. He's got the car stipends, all the type of stuff that comes with that and not that. Everything's about money.
Speaker 2:but but at some point it's got to be, and that's well.
Speaker 3:So then when you add to the season and your head coach and in those cities, like hey, we know you and he did a good job, I don't ever want to take any of that away from carter sheridan. He's a good ball coach, we know you coach that room a lot. Yeah, we know, you know, but I'm I can't ever put you on the field. You know you're gonna always be in this role because he has the connections and recruiting and stuff. So it's like you want me to hold the rope while somebody else climbs up it. You know. So anyway, that's another backstory why, yeah
Speaker 3:why not that I'm saying I'm mad and jada, but when this other opportunity comes about and you're thinking I can stay in this role, where you're always going to be and growing where I'm in, because somewhere I'll have a great relationship. He called me yesterday. You know, we we really good. One of my favorite people in the world, man dynamic, will be a head coach in the sec very shortly. All right, uh, but he and I get his. I understand the position he was in, but you're like man, I can stay here and probably never be appreciated for what I really do or go back into an organization where I was, where I felt like I could make an impact. Yeah, and that's kind of like I said, and God was pushing me there. Not only can I make an impact in the high school sports, I can push me back in the retirement system, which is one, and I get to spend more time being a family man, being a dad, being a husband and anyway.
Speaker 2:So that's probably I should have got to that answer a while ago and you can walk on any field you want to now, yeah, nobody can stop you.
Speaker 3:You're kind of in charge, they kind of need to let me there and do that. May get booed. But it's not it's like well, I have noticed that a little bit Not too much, but now that you're in this role, people feel like you're like the police or something.
Speaker 4:They're like I really just want to come hang out.
Speaker 3:And they're like yeah, coach, yeah, we'll have you here. And I'm like whoa, just chill out, man, we ain't trying to.
Speaker 2:I'm just coming to have a cup of coffee with you, yeah, anyway. Well, yeah, I mean we've talked to a ton of coaches over the years, but I will honestly say, like, you are genuinely one of the good guys and one of my favorite coaches of all time. You're not only a good coach, but you're a good friend and we appreciate you coming and spending some time with us today. I know you're busy. You got Jack at baseball, you got RC with you today and it's just a lot going on. So we really appreciate you.
Speaker 2:No, I appreciate y'all having me for sure, so I do Well you know, one of the pleasures of this podcast is the supporting cast, and we have some great supporters. Of course you know them very well Donnie Burnett and Chip Powell. A lot of people don't know about Chip's poetic prowess, or Donnie's. Most people don't know about Donnie's motivational prowess, but not Chip's poetic prowess. So we like to end every show with a motivational minute by our head, our coach, donnie Burnett, and New York Life agent Chip Powell, the last all-SEC cornerback from Auburn that carries the Powell name, 1986. Never let that go to waste. Actually, see.
Speaker 3:I actually watched him play.
Speaker 2:Did you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I did. I went to the 1986 Iron Bowl in Legion Field. Yep, I sure did so. I've actually. I don't think I ever told Chip that I've actually watched him play. Maybe one of these days I'll get his autograph.
Speaker 2:Well, I've not been able to get it yet.
Speaker 1:It cost $10. Well, you're going to get something even more special now, because he actually wrote a poem about you. Oh nice, so this is a.
Speaker 2:I have not heard this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is a world premiere of this Chip Powell poem here. This is a treat. Y'all are going to enjoy this world premiere of this, of uh, of this chip powell uh poem here. So, uh, this is it treats, this is the y'all gonna enjoy this all righty guys, it's great to be back.
Speaker 4:It's been forever I don't even know the time frame we've. We've been gone on the preferred experience. But uh, man, I have got, and man, I have got a number of poems that I've come up with here and I've got one special today really for our guests, our special guests, honoring Caleb Ross. One of Prattville's finest sons has come home and he's been on the trail through Troy and Tulane and he's back now working in Montgomery with the AHSAA and we're so proud of him. And with that I thought I'd put a poem together just in honor of Caleb Ross, and I'll start with it now.
Speaker 4:In New Orleans, where the Jazz Notes play, coach Ross arrived to coach the Green Wave With gumbo rich in Beignet's suite. Bourbon Street's charm made his heart skip a beat. He thrived in the city, vibrant and bright, cheering fans and thrilling nights. But home called out with a familiar song. So he packed his dreams and headed alone Back to the fields where his roots run deep. A new chapter awaits memories to keep Through. New Orleans, magic we'll linger near. Coach Ross returns with a heart full of cheer. There you go. That's honoring our guest Caleb Ross. Coach, I call him Coach, sometimes I call him Caleb, but he's Coach. Coach, I'm glad you're home. Welcome home.
Speaker 3:He's actually really good. He did a good job. I feel like I'm on the movie, mr D. Have you ever seen Mr?
Speaker 2:D, of course.
Speaker 3:I was awesome A hallmark chip. I never knew he'm on the movie Mr D. Did you ever see Mr D? Of course I was awesome A hallmark chip. I never knew he had that in him.
Speaker 2:He does. Not many people know that, but as the experience rolls on, more people are realizing that he's probably not long for this area. He's probably going to get called to New York.
Speaker 1:Chip Powell's full of poetry.
Speaker 3:It really was good. He did a good job with it. That was good. I couldn't do that, so I'm sure he listens. Hey, I appreciate that. Thank you, chip. That was awesome man and I know he's a family friend and our family is my dad and his dad coached my dad in high school and I get to coach his son. Man, our families will forever be connected and he is my insurance agent too.
Speaker 2:There you go. There's a common bond.
Speaker 3:But yeah, that's cool, that's really pretty cool.
Speaker 2:Well, let's close this thing out. Let me close every show out. On the Preferred Experience, the podcast with the Motivational Minute by Coach Donnie Burnett.
Speaker 5:This is Coach Donnie Burnett and here's today's Motivational Minute. Our quote today comes from Douglas Adams, and I think it's very fitting for Coach Ross. I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
Speaker 2:This is Coach Donnie Burnett, and that's today's Motivational Minute, or not, caleb, he's kind of talking about your end.
Speaker 3:No, but it's cool, I can live with that, that's good. No, that's good. You still got a long time to go.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, man. Yeah, like I said, but hey, that's fair, I think it's good.
Speaker 3:You still got a long time to go. Oh yeah, man. Yeah, like I said, but hey, that's fair. I think it's fair, I like it.
Speaker 2:Well, we like having you here today and we really appreciate it, and no better way to restart the Preferred Experience podcast than having you with us, and hopefully you'll be with us several more times as we roll on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we just touched the surface of just his college experience here lately. We just touched the surface of his college experience here lately.
Speaker 3:We ain't even got into the good old stories yet. We can talk about some private football.
Speaker 2:I'd love to Hours and hours and hours of material. They exist.
Speaker 1:And we still got the 800-pound gorilla in the room to talk about. The Miami trip will always be. We've got our perspective on on record. Now we need coaches perspective on this that is a.
Speaker 3:That is a chapter in the prattville book that needs to be written one of these days, along with a special chapter called mike mccabe too, but that's another story yes yes, in fact it'd be great to have him here, and also I want to thank Will Aliens.
Speaker 1:I want to thank Will Barrett here for crawling out from under the boat scraping barnacles off to come in off the bench and scam play for us today.
Speaker 2:I want to have you know that this can be yours, from the team who shot for $11. Shane Falco.
Speaker 1:Shane Falco jersey. It's the whole thing.
Speaker 2:It's the whole thing11. Shane Falco. Shane Falco jersey. It's the whole thing. It's the whole thing. I got it all Sugar. Shane Falco Footsteps. Falco, you can smell the stink all the way back in Wales.
Speaker 3:That's awesome. In case you don't know, you can see that movie it plays 14 times a week on.
Speaker 2:TNT. It does, it does. The Ratfish Shawshank Redemption. That's it. That's right, con Air. I bought that on Apple TV for $5 yesterday. It's one of my favorite movies of all time, con Air. It's great, it's still good. The greatest Nicolas Cage movie of all time.
Speaker 1:It is straight up the greatest accent ever in a movie. It is it is the worst fake southern accent of all time maybe, yeah, maybe.
Speaker 3:Forrest gump is a close second and it truly is one of those movies you're like man. Every time it's on. You find yourself watching eight minutes at a time, nine minutes why am I?
Speaker 2:why I've seen this exactly. It's terrible. It's great to turn on like 10 o'clock and just let it run. You're asleep.
Speaker 1:There's a reason why these channels play these movies repeatedly, repeatedly, because you've seen it a million times but you're going to stop watching. I call it the Shawshank effect. Every time Shawshank's on, you just got to watch it, that's it.
Speaker 2:No doubt 100% of the time.
Speaker 3:Never seen the whole movie, though. That's it. I was to start the finish. It was great. Looking forward to seeing it one day.
Speaker 2:Well, for Coach Ross, I'm Will Barrett and this is Mills, are behind the camera and that's RC over there in the producer's chair, and we'll see you next time.